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Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:04 pm
by Philzoid
Despite a worry about a camera flash when approaching Mirepoix on the way home from Carcassonne (a hidden speed trap: I think I've changed my mind about French roads :? :wink: ) I had much more important things on my mind as Tuesday (25th) was the first morning I'd awoken to sunshine :D . Time to check out the big buddleia bush opposite the campsite. So while the others dozed I sneaked out full of excitement and expectation and taking big strides to make my way up to the spot. As I approached I could see large orange butterflies around the bush and when I got there I could see that they were Silver-washed Fritillaries Argynnis paphia. A male came down and landed on a palette box which gave me this picture.
A 2015.08.25 IMG_4345 Silver-washed Fritillary (male) opposite campsite L'Arize t.jpg
The others were a bit too high up and also flighty making it difficult to get decent photographs. After a few minutes my presence seemed to put them all up in the trees. A nice start but a species I've seen and photographed many times in the South East :) . A Cardinal would've been a better find.
As well as the SWF's there was a Peacock which I got a shot of later.

As things had gone quiet at the butterfly bush I crossed over to the grassy verge on the other side of the road and was immediately into a Large Skipper.
B 2015.08.25 IMG_4400 Large Skipper (female), roadside grass verge by L'Arize campsite.jpg
But then another brown-orange butterfly caught my eye ...surely not? A Heath Fritillary Mellicta athalia, wings spread to catch the morning sun's warming rays :) .
Heath Fritillary
Heath Fritillary
As I continued my search along the road scanning both sides of the roadside grass verges, I encountered more and more Heath Fritillaries. In fact they appeared to be the commonest species though by no means the only species. Small Copper Lycaena phlaes were also evident and a worn Sooty Copper Lycaena tityrus (my first lifer) put in an appearance.
Another Heath Fritillary
Another Heath Fritillary
E 2015.08.25 IMG_4427 Small Copper. roadside verge nr. L'Arize campsite m.jpg
Worn Sooty Copper
Worn Sooty Copper
I then spotted another copper which appeared to be like a Small but browner and lacking the lustre of phlaes. The low level bright sunshine (and lack of camera craft) made the photography difficult. However I've since concluded that this was indeed just another Small Copper, a third generation form of (but no 'blue badges').
Small Copper not lustrous and with some hind-wing scuffing
Small Copper not lustrous and with some hind-wing scuffing
H 2015.08.25 IMG_4565 Small Copper (3rd brood), roadside verge nr. L'Arize campsite.jpg
The heaths seemed to show a lot of variation. In actuality they weren't all Heaths as there was the occasional Glanville Fritillary Melitaea cinxia in there too :o . Also I later learned that there are three other very similar species to the Heath Fritillary in this region: these being the Provencal Mellicta deione; Meadow Mellicta parthenoides and False Heath Mellitaea diamina. I've since discounted the last species but I will post my other Heath pictures later. I'm hoping someone may be able to identify one or both of the other two species as being among them, if at all possible from a photo :?:
Glannie but not a good pic
Glannie but not a good pic
As well as the Frits and Coppers I spotted Small White Pieris rapae (almost certain not Southern Small P. mannii); Small Heath; Gatekeeper; a (worn) Long-tailed Blue; Wood (Real's Wood?) White and Map. Meadow Browns were common too, mostly female, slightly larger than the ones at home with a bolder underside eye-spot. Along paths, often in more shady areas they would take off from the ground and land about 6 feet ahead of you flashing their underside eyespot. As you walked up to them this would occur again and again until eventually they'd go past you and back to where they (presumably) started from.

from now on pictures are, as they say on Strictly "in no particular order"
Small White
Small White
Wood White (Real's?)
Wood White (Real's?)
L 2015.08.25 IMG_4512 Small Heath, roadside verge nr. L'Arize campsite.jpg
M 2015.08.25 IMG_4564 Gatekeeper, roadside verge nr. L'Arize campsite t.jpg
N 2015.08.25 IMG_4455 Peacock; Buddliea outside L'Arize campsite.jpg
O 2015.08.25 IMG_4535 Map, roadside verge, nr. L'Arize campsite.jpg
P 2015.08.25 IMG_4609 Map, roadside verge, nr. L'Arize campsite.jpg
Q 2015.08.25 IMG_4618 Map, roadside verge nr. L'Arize campsite.jpg
Another insect which caught my attention was a huge hornet mimic hoverfly which I knew wasn't the familiar Volucella zonaria seen back home. This is I think Milesia crabroniformis.
Milesia crabroniformis Hornet mimic hoverfly
Milesia crabroniformis Hornet mimic hoverfly
Silver-washed Fritillary
Silver-washed Fritillary
Heath Fritillary
Heath Fritillary
Heath Fritillaries
Heath Fritillaries
V 2015.08.25 IMG_4560 Small Copper, roadside verge nr. L'Arize campsite t.jpg
Heath Fritillary
Heath Fritillary
Heath Fritillary & Map
Heath Fritillary & Map
And a final flourish: a Humming-bird Hawk-moth :D
Y 2015.08.25 IMG_4624 Hummingbird Hawk-moth, roadside verge nr. L'Arize campsite.jpg
14 species and counting. What a difference a bit of sunshine makes :D .

Phil

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:45 pm
by Padfield
Hi Phil. I'm generally wary of identifying Melitaea sp. from ups alone - especially in the South of France, where some athalia ssp. celadussa can show a lot of the characteristics of deione. But your underside shot must surely be diamina (false heath). The dark in the p.d. orange spots is not so clearly defined as you might see in the books, but bear in mind that only a little further south, in the Pyrenees proper, form vernetensis flies, which typically lacks the dark centres. In contrast, ssp. celadussa of athalia (heath fritillary) has rather bright orange spots there.

The last heath frit, with the map, has a lot of parthenoides (meadow frit) about it, but to my mind it's not 100% conclusive. Sometimes heath frits do show a very oblique spot in s1b.

EDIT: Mmm... The female in the shot with two 'heath' frits looks very like a female meadow frit. I'd put money on that one.

Guy

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:04 pm
by David M
Lovely summer brood Maps, Phil. This is one species I don't see in the alpine region.

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:49 pm
by Chris Jackson
Nice photos Phil.
They are reminding me of happy summer days which, even down in Marseilles as I write, seem to be getting further away.
I did a double-take on your Small White though. That dark apical patch seems to extend further down the trailing edge than I would have expected.

Photo No. 12 - Small Heath ?
Photo No. 13 - female Southern Gatekeeper ?

I love the Maps.
As David suggests, you can be in a great butterfly region, but it does not guarantee you that you'll necessarily see a Map.
I don't get these around Marseilles.

Cheers, Chris

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 5:13 pm
by Roger Gibbons
Re the Small White, I think a fork on the vein can just be seen, which would confirm Small and not Southern Small White. There are other clues, too.

The False Heath - the marginal band doesn't seem particularly yellow and contrasted which I would expect for False Heath, and the band seems rather narrow and regular. This isn't very clear from the photo, so maybe a close-up is needed. The unf lunule in s2 is also heavily shaded, which would normally be indicative of Heath. The unh post-discal spaces do look right for False Heath though.

Roger

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 6:20 pm
by Charles Nicol
thanks for sharing your wonderful photos Phil.

the first one of the SWF on the pallet is very striking.

i have never seen Maps in the Midi :cry:

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:02 pm
by Philzoid
Padfield wrote:Hi Phil. I'm generally wary of identifying Melitaea sp. from ups alone - especially in the South of France, where some athalia ssp. celadussa can show a lot of the characteristics of deione.
Thanks for your assessments on the fritillaries Guy :) . I agree with your comments and as I suspected one is unlikely to get a conclusive ID from a photo alone although an underside combined with upperside is more helpful. There are more pictures to come and I said I have kept a few behind (of my ‘better ones’) for a separate best guess identity parade posting.
I have read on Matt Rowlings site that in the field genital determination of the males is a conclusive way to separate these closely related species :o , and in the hands of skilled operators does no harm to the insect (unlike moth gen dets). Is this a technique you would employ or do you rely solely on your knowledge of specific features, geographical locations, habitats, informed literature and behavioural cues etc?

I am very much a novice when it comes to species abroad and adopted a scattergun approach to grab as much as I could in the limited time available. If I was able to repeat the experience I might be less obsessed about the species totals and more inclined to focus some more attention on the difficult ones to ID. Anyway there are some more identification conundrums to keep you all busy further on in this series of postings :wink: .

Your comments about the diamina (and female parthenoides) came as a pleasant surprise :) . The underside markings of this insect were pretty bold (sadly that’s the limit of my knowledge on how to describe it :oops: ) and for me, the apex of the forewing stands out as looking somewhat different to the others (not that I’ve got many others from my holiday to compare with). I don’t remember seeing any fritillary with a heavily marked upper hind-wing and it was with this reasoning that I discounted diamina in my posting. I now know that the False Heath is very variable with respect to this feature, so it may be that I overlooked it :| . However, in general, I thought the Ariege small fritillary upper-sides were much lighter marked than I remembered seeing on the athalia in the UK earlier this year. And, what I would say is that these 'sunny day, out in the open French frits', were certainly harder to get near to than the athalia in the coppiced woodland at East Blean :lol: .
David M wrote:Lovely summer brood Maps, Phil. This is one species I don't see in the alpine region.
I checked my 'main book' Collins Field Guide Butterflies Britain and Europe (Tolman and Lewington) and the Map does not feature in the region I saw it. However the text and distribution maps were compiled in 1997 so the butterfly may have expanded its range since then. Perhaps I need a new edition of the book?
cjackson wrote:Photo No. 13 - female Southern Gatekeeper ?
Thanks for your kind comments Chris. I thought number 13 was a 'standard' female Gatekeeper Pyronia tithonus :o (hence I didn't bother naming it (12 Small Heath definitely)) so now I'm going to check my book.
Roger Gibbons wrote:Re the Small White, I think a fork on the vein can just be seen, which would confirm Small and not Southern Small White.
I remember coming across a posting on this very site explaining the differences between the two species and that's why I concluded rapae and not mannii I have another photo taken of a different insect which is less clear, but in fairness partly due to the not so good picture. I will probably tag it on to the end of the fritillary posting later.
Roger Gibbons wrote:The False Heath - the marginal band doesn't seem particularly yellow and contrasted which I would expect for False Heath, and the band seems rather narrow and regular. This isn't very clear from the photo, so maybe a close-up is needed. The unf lunule in s2 is also heavily shaded, which would normally be indicative of Heath. The unh post-discal spaces do look right for False Heath though.
Thanks for your input Roger :) The photo is not that good unfortunately. Later on I have other better underside pictures which hopefully will be conclusive.
Charles Nicol wrote:the first one of the SWF on the pallet is very striking.
he came down from the bush to check me out :D
Charles Nicol wrote:i have never seen Maps in the Midi
it seems that fro yours; Chris's and David's comments not to mention my (outdated) book that Map was a good find for this region. You may have noted that I did not put it down as a "lifer" as this was the species of butterfly that turned up in Dorset late last summer and I was fortunate to get the opportunity to go and see it (them). There was also a lot of debate regarding its origin because the species is expanding its range. However in this case the source was I believe, a release :shock: .

Phil

Phil

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:41 pm
by Padfield
Just a quick note on the false Heath. Roger is right that the heavy branding under the forewing is typical of athalia, but it is also found in form vernetensis of diamina - and is often heavier in this form than in athalia. In the foothills of the Pyrenees, I would expect to see vernetensis or a transitional form. The yellow marginal line is variable in colour. I'd be pretty confident this is diamina, with the caveat that Roger spends more time in this part of the world and in the end I would trust his judgment.

Re squeezing the butterfly's bottom to expose its private parts: although this is clearly preferable to killing if you can do it properly, I've never attempted it and probably will not in the future. There is obvious potential to harm the butterfly. I am with Matt in the field a lot and can vouch for the fact he doesn't generally do it either, though I know he has in the past. If this means some individuals escape identification, so be it. If I thought I had discovered a previously unknown Swiss population of some Melitaea species I would alert the Swiss recorder and if there was doubt he would probably take a single individual and identify it with certainty - as he did with a population of Erebia eriphyle I showed him.

I do, however, carry a net, so I can take upperside and underside photos of problematic butterflies.

Guy

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:03 pm
by David M
Philzoid wrote:I checked my 'main book' Collins Field Guide Butterflies Britain and Europe (Tolman and Lewington) and the Map does not feature in the region I saw it. However the text and distribution maps were compiled in 1997 so the butterfly may have expanded its range since then. Perhaps I need a new edition of the book?
Not sure how far away from Ax-les-Thermes you were, Phil, but when I visited that area in 2012 I saw both spring brood Maps at altitude as well as summer brood at lower levels on successive days!!

They're definitely present!

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:09 pm
by Wurzel
Great shots and report Philzoid and pretty jammy - from one to three species in one posting :mrgreen: :wink: Looking forward to the the next instalment for more great shots, more new species and as an impetus to get my arse in gear and sort my own foreign foray.

Have a goodun

Wurzel

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 10:23 pm
by Philzoid
Wurzel wrote:Great shots and report Philzoid and pretty jammy - from one to three species in one posting
well .... perhaps :? :wink:
Wurzel wrote:and as an impetus to get my arse in gear and sort my own foreign foray.
half term coming up ...perhaps a chance for a break? Whenever you do get around to doing it it's going to be a cracking post :)
David M wrote: I saw both spring brood Maps at altitude as well as summer brood at lower levels on successive days!!
Great stuff :) ... and it that would've been an even bigger feat if you'd got the intermediate form too (f. porima) :wink:
Padfield wrote:I do, however, carry a net, so I can take upperside and underside photos of problematic butterflies.
I have taken a net with me once to Sheepleas for help with identifying micromoths but ended up using it to get a closer look of a small brown butterfly which turned out to be a very worn Chalk-hill Blue (released unharmed afterwards of course). If I was in your position Guy I would take a net too. Overall though, the butterflies in the UK are not quite as 'problematic' as the species encountered in Europe to warrant the 'extra paraphernalia' :wink: .

BTW I'm not sure but didn't Roger err to athalia rather than diamina :?

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 10:32 pm
by Philzoid
Hi Chris
I've had another look at my female (Southern) Gatekeeper and it's compelling to believe it might be cecilia .... the more extensive orange on the hind-wing, the lack of any hint of an eyespot on the hind-wing too, plus the indent next to the forewing large eyespot. The habitat though was where you'd expect to find tithonus lush bushy margins near woodland rather than the dryer rocky places where cecilia haunts. If I'd got an underside that would've been conclusive.

Wished I'd paid it more attention :(

Phil

Re: Holiday to France Part 2

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 10:46 pm
by Roger Gibbons
I was just making observations on the diamina, to the effect that it didn't look quite right. Just a bit of verbal head-scratching. I felt that the default was probably to diamina. I only saw one vernetensis (and Guy is right about the shading) near Puymorens in July and was busy observing something else in the naive belief that I would get to see more, which of course I didn't.