Help! which camera and lense

[andy brown]

Hi,

I know this will probably result in an overload of advice but here goes!

At the recent Photo workshop I was presented conundrum on the camera front, what I am looking for is to but a camera, lens or lenses and a tripod (probably the Manfrotto 190CXPRO4) etc. I have approximately £2000 to spend (a bit more if needed) and wish to avoid as many mistakes as possible i.e. not waste money, I will be using the equipment for butterflies and moths!

If possible I could meet up and go through what’s needed via a practical if that would help me choose correctly if anyone one would be willing and have the time.

Thanks in advance

Andy

[Pete Eeles]

Hi Andy - where are you based? In terms of "kit", I'd consider the basic set to be the following - all of which cost money!

Camera body
Tripod
Tripod head
Bag
Batteries
Memory cards
Software (e.g. Adobe Lightroom or PaintShop Pro or Photostop - I use Lightroom)

Optional items are many! But would include:

Remote release cable
External flash
Macro rails
Extension tubes
Teleconverter
Monitor calibration hardware/software
Decent printer and cartridges
Sensor cleaning kit
Reflector

I think that covers everything I can see from my desk! I'm sure others can add to this list!

Cheers,

- Pete

[andy brown]

Hi again Pete, thanks for the list it certaily gives me things to tick of as I go, I was hoping to get details of makes and models of camera etc, I know it will be down to personal preferance in some cases! I live just north of Farham in Wickham.

Cheers

Andy

[JKT]

I think that covers everything I can see from my desk! I'm sure others can add to this list!

I think a lens or two would help as well.

[Pete Eeles]

I think that covers everything I can see from my desk! I'm sure others can add to this list!

I think a lens or two would help as well.

Indeed - a dedicated macro lens!

Cheers,

- Pete

[Gruditch]

Hi Andy, Glad to see that for once, someone is talking about using a realistic amount of dosh, and includes a tripod on their list of needs.

At the recent workshop, if I had asked for a show of hands, as to which brand people use.
Undoubtedly the vast majority would of been Canon, with a few Nikon users, and one or two people using Sony, Olympus etc. That's not because Canon are heads and shoulders better than the rest, in fact any DSLR in the right hands will give great results. Its just in the UK, Canon for whatever reason have the greater market share. In some other country's ( so I'm told, can't believe it ), Nikon are the dominant brand, but wherever you go it will always be Canon, or Nikon.

Why ?, because they can both offer you everything, from entry level, too top pro body's, full frame DSLR's, and every lens you will ever need. The other brands just can't do that.

You may not at this time envisage yourself ever wanting, a full frame camera, or a 600mm wildlife lens. But if that's where your photography does takes you, you will be kicking yourself for the wrong decision at the start.

All that said, if money was tight, Sony and Olympus do have unbelievably cheap entry level models.

But as money isn't a issue here, I would look only at Nikon or Canon.
Just looking on http://www.warehouseexpress.com/home/default.aspx
You can get a Canon two lens 1000D starter kit for under five hundred quid,
and a Nikon D3000 with two lenses for ruffly the same.

For quite a few people on this forum, the wonderful Sigma 150mm F/2.8 is the favoured Macro, but for some reason the Sigma 180mm, on the above site is 80 quid cheaper at 478.99.

The tripod you are looking at, is a fantastic light weight bit of kit, with a descent ball, or trigger head, you are looking at 270 quid.

Humm looks to me like you may end up with some dosh to spare, maybe a higher up camera body is in order.

I live near Danebury, where we had the workshop field trip, if your willing to travel that far, I would be happy to give you some hands on practical advise, but as its all I have, it will only be a Canon hand on practical advise.



Kind regards Gruditch ( Gary )

[JKT]

Those two Sigmas are good and so would be the Tamron 180/3.5.

Then again, you wanted to photograph moths as well. Unless you want them in flight, those 180's seem a bit long. A 100/2.8 would be better there. It is also easier to increase magnification with shorter lenses should you ever turn to micro moths. On the other hand, butterflies are more difficult with them so you would have to consider carefully whether you want just one in 100 mm range or a pair with one shorter (60-70) and one longer (150-180).

There is also the question of proper body. Macro work is often manual focus and that is somewhat difficult with the low end bodies. A bit better, used body might be another option. Live view is another factor - if the subject is static. Older bodies might not have it or it may be cumbersome.

[andy brown]

Gruditch & Gary

I was looking at the Canon D7 Body or buy it as a package with the lens it comes with for general work and buy an additional lens for the butterflies and moths, on the moth front apart from the day flying ones they are caught in a trap and photographed in the morning when placid which makes it much easier. Gruditch if possible I would like to take you up on the offer soon for some advice etc before I commit as whilst you say I may have a few quid left but it is still a big commitment so don’t want to mess up. I currently have an intermediate Panasonic FZ28 which does take some pretty good shots so this will be a major step up and have an example picture in the April comp of a male Orange tip! But when seen against some of the others does look out of place

Thanks

Andy

[NickB]

I agree with Gary - Canon seem to have the best range of bodies for semi-pro/amateur use - whether it is megapixels or full-frame you want, Canon can even offer a choice. I jumped with Nikon (if you think the new L series Canon lenses are expensive, then just look at the new Nikon VR ones!) so I used 3rd party lenses initially with my D300. JKT is right to say a 100mm f2.8 is a good length to go with - I use a Tamron 90mm - but I found I wanted a bigger image, so I also shoot that with a Kenco Pro 3000 1.4 teleconverter attached.
I found this a really useful set-up. However, for larger butterflies and those which are difficult to approach, I ended up with a second-hand Nikkor 200mm f4.0 macro which I tend to keep on most of the time. The Sigma 150mm and Tamron 180mm macro are good examples of longer focal lengths available for Canon.
My advice is not to spend a lot on more lenses first off - as you say, the learning curve from a bridge camera is a big one (I had an FZ50 ...Panasonic really are kings in this space) and I spent a lot on lenses (to cover a big range) I have retired later as not up to the quality required. A lot on a single good lens gets something you will actually use most of the time....
Sounds like you are on the way with your choices...
Good luck
N
Oh - and I have a Manfrotto 190 tripod (following last year's workshop) but not the carbon-fibre one; I have used it zero times for butterflies!
A Manfrotto 679B monopod and ball-head 484RC2 remain my choice - for all the reasons of ease of use and weight (well it is a bit lighter than that tripod...)

[andy brown]

Sorry meant to say thanks to Gruditch (Gary) and JKT in my earlier post , so Gary you say the Sigma 180mm is cheaper is that what you would recommend? I am currently putting a spreadsheet together for things I need and will price up from sources and go to them for discount if I buy the lot from one place any ideas if this will save much or give you any leverage in anyway

Cheers
Andy

[Gruditch]

I've used the Sigma 150, and had a quick go with both the Sigma, and Canon 180, unfortunately not had the Chance to try out the Tamron 180. To be honest I would be happy with any of them, so I would go after the best bargainyou can get, at the mo that's the Sigma 180, from Warehouse Express.

Look at this site for the best high street prices, http://www.camerapricebuster.co.uk/

If I were buying, I would get the macro as cheap as I could, then get whichever camera you decide to go with, from a high street specialist camera shop, ie not Jessops.
You may end up forking out a bit more, but a good shop will give you discount for loyalty, so you should get your money back in time. Plus when it comes to updating your gear, they will be more generous if you got it from them in the first place.

Nick was being very diplomatic BTW, there's nothing to choose between Canon and Nikon. Its a endless battle, with one after the other gaining a edge.

Regards Gruditch

[Rogerdodge]

Andy
I have owned a Sigma 180 for 6 or 7 year now (pre-digital).
In fact it is the very lens that Gary has had "a quick go with".
It is a brilliant lens - razor sharp and excellent contrast.
The price at Warehouseexpress is pretty good.
You certainly won't be making a mistake pairing this up with a good prosumer DSLR.
I must echo Nick and Gary and say that there is little to choose in quality, robustness or image quality between Canon and Nikon.
I use Canon because I had Canon pre-digital - it could have just as easily been Nikon.
Good luck, and don't forget that there is no substitute for hours in the field and banging off loads of frames.
Looking forward to seeing your shots on here soon.