www.ukbutterflies.co.uk

Another from Romania.

Could this be Zephyr Blue? Again, I've never seen this species so if anyone has any pointers they'd be very welcome:

Hi David
I've seen this species in Greece, and the first thing to say is that it is quite variable. Usually, an upperside photo would be the preferred view. On the underside alone, Zephyr Blue is a distinct possibility, however. (The upperside hindwing tends to have distinctive black marks on the lower edge).

Others on this forum would be in a better place than me to give their longer experience and expertise.
Hope this helps
Paul

This looks very good for sephirus, though like Paul I wouldn't like to commit on a single view of the underside. It is clearly Plebejus, and shows no evidence at all of any metallic scales in the black spots, despite seeming quite fresh. The general appearance has the feel of the pylaon group, though my only experience of this group is of the rather distinct, alpine species, trappi.

If I were judging a civil case, sephirus would win, on balance of probabilities. If it were a criminal case, I don't think it meets the 'beyond reasonable doubt' threshold!

Guy

Thanks, Paul/Guy.

Not having seen this species before, the only element that appeared to suggest sephirus to me was the white area that breaks up the submarginal orange lunules next to the lowest vein of the hindwing.

I couldn't really think of any other species it could realistically be, but then that's not reason enough to positively identify it as the species the photographer thinks it is!

Hi David. That feature is one of many pointing to sephirus. It's present in trappi - very closely related to sephirus - but not in either argus or idas, the other possible Plebejus species from the region. On the balance of probabilities, I fall squarely for sephirus for this butterfly. A single metallic scale would have ruled it out, but there isn't one - and usually you can find at least one on idas or argus.

Guy


(trappi - once considered conspecific with sephirus)


(argus)


(idas)

I must admit I don’t really follow the science very closely when it comes to this species/species complex but despite the subtle differences they all still look like zephyrs to me.

David’s original photo is very zephyr (I guess female) - and if from Romania then I suppose it must be as you say.

In the northeast of Turkey they’re all supposed to be modicus - Anatolian zephyr blue - at least according to the map from the best website for Turkish butterflies.
It’s a very common butterfly there and I find it all over the place. It is, however, very variable as these photos show (I can’t imagine we’ve seen the end of the splitting/reclassification games somehow).
The missing orange lunule in the series is usually enough, but as Guy’s photos show once you get your eye in it really doesn’t look much like idas or argus anyway (and certainly not like anything further removed)

That’s fascinating Ben - not least because some of your piccies show metallic scales! I’ll have to review that criterion!

Guy

Although to be honest, and now that I look closer, that bottom left one is causing me some problems. It looks like a mix between idas and zephyr. One where you really need to wait to see the upperside.

I think in the field I had it down as a zephyr that broke the shiny scale rule (and I liked that) but perhaps the rule holds after all. The books, I think, suggest one spot of shiny scales max, but as this spot is very often shiny and sometimes very bold I always suspected there would be more variation.

Thoughts welcome!

Thanks for the insight into the situation in Turkey, Ben. What a melting pot that country is for so many things.

Nice illustration you provided, Guy. It seems altogether rather easier when everything's laid out in images.

My , so far , fruitless search for this species in Spain , which I will continue this spring , means that my comments are based on information from those that have had more success.
The identification features that would make me look in more detail are

1. The lack of Orange lunule as previously mentioned by everyone
2. The Orange lunules narrow where they meet the outer row of sub marginal black marks as shown strongly in Guys photograph of Pylaon.

From a Spanish perspective , the photographs I have seen , appear to hold true for these two id pointers