www.ukbutterflies.co.uk

Hi Pete,
Lovely ab. shots, and most impressed with your fowleri, particularly the Stockbridge specimen. From memory ab. krodeli is the equivalent ab. in bellargus, so that's probably ab. postcaeca. Could be wrong ... abs. aren't my speciality, but certainly worth checking.
Best Wishes, Neil

Thank you Pete, I had a smashing morning and really didn't want to leave the site. You are great company and pointed out far more butterflies to me than vice versa! You have my permission to visit the site any time you like

Oh, and just for you, I put this together from my pictures taken this morning

Susie wrote:Oh, and just for you, I put this together from my pictures taken this morning

936520_10151824950886972_242932573_n.jpg

LOL [I mentioned to Susie that I didn't really like images that have artistic effects applied ]

Cheers,

- Pete

Sussex Kipper wrote:From memory ab. krodeli is the equivalent ab. in bellargus, so that's probably ab. postcaeca

Thanks Neil. You are, of course, absolutely right! Got my species mixed up! Given the rules of precedence, while this is ab. postcaeca (Leeds), the "correct" name is ab. postica-obsoleta (Tutt), which really rolls off the tongue. Not.

Cheers,

- Pete

Back on the Green Isle - Day 1
I'm in Ireland with two of my sons for a few days, having taken the ferry from Fishguard to Rosslare on Thursday afternoon, before travelling up to Dublin. Yesterday was spent in the capital and, having taken a tour around the city, my two sons decided to make a beeline for the Guinness factory, so I decided to drive over to the North Bull Island Nature Reserve. Here I caught my first glimpse of Meadow Brown ssp. iernes. The key distinguishing feature (as shown on the species page) is "Male forewing upperside has a well-defined orange band". Unfortunately, only one male was willing to show his upperside for a photo (see below for a poor shot), but I can confirm that the males do, indeed, have large orange patches on the forewings, and some specimens of this subspecies look very much like an overgrown Gatekeeper when in flight! Most of the adults are past their best, but I hope to catch up with this subspecies again tomorrow when in Co. Kerry.

While at the site I was fortunate to meet Frank Smyth, who is one of a small number of prolific recorders based in Dublin. We had a good natter about a variety of subjects, and Frank pointed me in the direction of a Grayling colony on the reserve. Unfortunately, I failed to find any Grayling at the site and the weather certainly didn't help - I was in danger of getting the biggest soaking I've had since I rescued a brick from drowning back in my schooldays
The main reason for visiting, however, was to take a look at the progress of the Marsh Fritillary larvae (I found 2 females laying on the same leaf a while back). Frank assured me that there were quite a few large larval webs to be found, and I was sure he must have been referring to the one that stemmed from the 2 egg batches I saw being laid. However, once I'd relocated these, the total web must have been less than a foot wide. A further search quickly resulted in more larval webs, ranging from those that must be an amalgamation of 4 or 5 egg batches, up to a few that were absolutely massive - up to 5 or 6 feet in length and 2 or 3 feet wide. I was rather gobsmacked at the number of larval webs in general, and had to be very careful where I tread! In the space of 30 minutes I must have found at least 30 webs, several of which were part of large amalgamations.
And finally, I also came across a few summer brood Green-veined White ssp. britannica which exhibited quite striking markings when compared with those back home. They seemed to exhibit markings that were, once again, somewhat different from the Green-veined White I'd seen earlier in the year at Craigavon Lakes in Northern Ireland and in the Burren.
Cheers,

- Pete

Ireland - Day 2
Today was spent travelling from east to west, eventually ending up in Galway. A stop for a coffee overlooking Galway Bay, with the Burren looking imposing on the other side of the bay, looked quite enticing from a Lepidoptera perspective! And so, on the way down to Limerick (where we're based for the last 2 days of the trip), I decided to pop in at the south side of the Burren - at Boston. I had no idea what I might find, but I knew the area and was hopeful that I might catch up with some specialties. First stop was at a small nature reserve just before you get to Boston. I was hoping to get a decent shot of a male Meadow Brown and, although I found a few, none was posing for pictures and the weather certainly didn't help! And then, out of the blue, this chap landed right in front of me, which I really wasn't expecting!
We carried on to Boston, and I couldn't have been on the limestone pavement for 30 seconds, when I caught sight of my first ever Grayling ssp. clarensis, which lived up to its reputation of being extremely pale when compared with other subspecies and looked really "washed out" despite some being very fresh! These were, to my surprise, the commonest species by far, with one being flushed up every minute or so!
One species I was hoping to find at some point, but isn't something you can really plan to see with any certainly, was the Small Copper ssp. hibernica. Fortunately, one (and only one) was guarding his territory in a sheltered spot, and exhibiting the broad orange band on the hindwing that is one of the characteristics of this subspecies.
And finally, the other nice surprise of the afternoon, a lovely male Brimstone ssp. gravesi. It definitely lived up to its reputation of having a greener underside, since this male (and it definitely is a male - characteristically yellow in flight!) looked just like a female when settled! The two photos below are of the same individual, the second shot being backlit.
Cheers,

- Pete

Fantastic images Pete Sometimes I can't see much difference in the "sub species/races" and think that sometimes it's just a geographical decision - they're on an island so they're different almost But the Grayling do look much paler than those I've seen this year

Have a goodun

Wurzel

Thanks Wurzel!

Wurzel wrote:Sometimes I can't see much difference in the "sub species/races" and think that sometimes it's just a geographical decision - they're on an island so they're different almost

Well, it's always geographic separation that results in the formation of subspecies, so that's certainly true! And yes, the difference can be remarkably subtle!

Cheers,

- Pete

Fascinating and instructive Pete.

Anyway, despite visits to central Ireland in both the spring and summer, I have yet to see Brimstone. The Burren in 2011 was fascinating if only for the three days of non-stop heavy rain! Of course no butterflies seen then.

We have an unwanted fully-furnished “second home” in Co.Cavan so we visit Ireland regularly. (House going cheap if anyone’s interested: the housing market collapsed after the boom years). We had planned going this month but my knee problems put a stop to that. A visit is planned again next spring and maybe before as well.

Jack

Thanks Jack. Yes, trips to Ireland are always governed by the weather and I do consider myself very lucky to have found a few sunny spells!

Ireland - Part 3
The last Irish subspecies I was on the lookout for was Grayling ssp. hibernica. Despite travelling 200+ miles in search of the beasty, I drew a blank, and this particular nemesis will have to now wait until next year (at least I have an excuse to go back)! I fear I was simply too late in the season. Visits to Dunquin on the Dingle Peninsula in County Kerry, Knockadoon in County Cork, and The Raven in County Wexford provided stunning scenery nonetheless. The last site was particularly productive, despite arriving at 6pm. Common Blue and Small Copper abounded and I managed to get some shots of both. As I've said before, the female Common Blue look quite normal to me and I wonder if ssp. mariscolore is confined to north-west Ireland only. I also managed to get some underside shots of the Small Coppers, showing the prominent red band on the underside that this a characteristic of this subspecies, as well as the wide orange band on the hindwing upperside. I also had an obliging Red Admiral ovipositing while at Knockadoon.
Cheers,

- Pete

I've gotten out when I can over the last few days - some shots below. The highlights were spending time with UKB's Mark Colvin watching fantastic numbers of butterflies in Chiddingfold Forest, and also finding a couple of Holly Blue ova on the ivy at home, which both hatched the following day.

Chiddingfold Forest Greenham Common Home Cheers,

- Pete

Pete Eeles wrote:The last Irish subspecies I was on the lookout for was Grayling ssp. hibernica. Despite travelling 200+ miles in search of the beasty, I drew a blank, and this particular nemesis will have to now wait until next year (at least I have an excuse to go back)! I fear I was simply too late in the season. Visits to Dunquin on the Dingle Peninsula in County Kerry, Knockadoon in County Cork, and The Raven in County Wexford provided stunning scenery nonetheless.

It Ain't Over until ...
An unexpected turn of events at work required me to be back in Dublin tomorrow. Working out the logistics meant that I could, feasibly, spend some time today butterflying. Seeing that the weather was going to be ok, I trawled the excellent ButterflyIreland website for current and old records of Grayling (ssp. hibernica). I was surprised that both this year, and in past years, there had been sightings of Grayling well into September, many sightings at Ballyteigue Burrow Nature Reserve in County Wexford, on the south coast. A brief correspondence with David Nash confirmed that the place is one of the best sites in Ireland for Grayling!

And so a 0415 start, 0640 flight and 2 1/2 hour drive found me at the reserve - but the place is huge and the Grayling (I was told) were in an area about 4 miles from where I parked. The reserve is essentially a long spit, and there's not really any way to get closer to the area I needed to visit. Since I could do with the exercise , I loaded up with water and some food, and headed off.
Quite fresh Meadow Brown (ssp. iernes) were flying but I had to be single-minded and find my nemesis! After (I estimate) 2 miles, I saw what I thought was a Dark Green Fritillary but, blow me down, it was the largest Grayling I've ever seen - an absolutely huge female Grayling ssp. hibernica flashing its orange-brown upperside as it flew! This area produced a dozen Grayling in total and it was fascinating watching males guard their territories and lurch up at anything that flew by.
Moving on to the recommended area, Grayling were everywhere and I estimate I saw at least 50 individuals in total, including females egg-laying and a couple of pairs "in cop". But the highlight (after several failed attempts on this trip and others) was filming the Grayling courtship ritual to its conclusion - a mating pair! Watching the male draw the female's antennae over his sex brands seemed to put the female under a spell since, as you can see, he moves around to the side to mate with her. Top stuff! I've now seen 5 of the 6 Grayling subspecies - ssp. atlantica is definitely a 2014 target!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNat4V3XlwI[/video]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vHzIVvIUv8[/video]

With the Grayling "in the bag" (not literally!) I then searched out the Meadow Brown, which were much fresher than those I'd seen at North Bull Island in Dublin on previous trips. As luck would have it, I managed to get the very shot I was after - an upperside of a male Meadow Brown ssp. iernes that has extensive orange patches and which, back home, would almost certainly be mistaken for a female!
To top it off, I not only caught up with a freshly-emerged Small Copper ssp. hibernica, but also saw half a dozen Wall to boot, topping off one of the best butterflying days I've had this year!
Cheers,

- Pete

Hi Pete,

Great work

I particularly liked the video footage and think you did exceptionally well to capture the actual pairing ...

Will we recognise you after all that exercise

Speak soon ...

Kindest regards. Mark

Yes, really well done to capture the pairing. What a special moment!

Guy

Cracking shots and video Pete When I questioned the classification I guess I was a little vague what I should have asked is why they are considered a subspecies and not just part if a cline, is there sufficient genetic difference to make these sub-species? If this hasn't been checked then what about the Wall Brown it's on an island and it could show exceedingly subtle variation from individuals on this side of the Irish Sea so how come it isn't considered a sub-species along with the others?

Have a goodun

Wurzel

Wurzel wrote:why they are considered a subspecies and not just part if a cline, is there sufficient genetic difference to make these sub-species? If this hasn't been checked then what about the Wall Brown it's on an island and it could show exceedingly subtle variation from individuals on this side of the Irish Sea so how come it isn't considered a sub-species along with the others?

A similar thought had crossed my mind.

Does there have to be some kind of visual difference to attain ssp status? Although I can see such a difference in the Meadow Brown, I have to confess that I can't with the Small Copper. So, why is phlaeas considered a subspecies yet Wall Brown is not?

Brown Hairstreak must be the best geographical candidate for subspecies status in Ireland, as it is only found in the far west and it isn't a butterfly that flies long distances, meaning that there can be no dilution of the genes from the British mainland. However, betulae isn't terribly prone to visual aberrations whereas Graylings, for example, are.

Am I the only one that's confused?

Thanks for all the kind comments Yes - that Grayling "moment" was, indeed, very special!

Wurzel wrote:why they are considered a subspecies and not just part if a cline

According to the web, a cline is "A continuum with an infinite number of gradations from one extreme to the other". While this applies to species such as Large Heath and Speckled Wood, this wouldn't seem to apply to Grayling (i.e. there are deemed to be distinct and specific differences between subspecies and these characteristics don't "blend" into one another).

Wurzel wrote:is there sufficient genetic difference to make these sub-species?

As Guy once remarked, there are no such things as species (let alone subspecies!) and he's right, given that something like 25% of species hybridise in the wild if you look across all of the European species (see http://www.ucl.ac.uk/taxome/jim/pap/des ... 0print.pdf). A species is a man-made distinction that is an aid to classifying and communicating groups of individuals with common characteristics and a subspecies is a man-made distinction too. As far as I'm aware, while some DNA analysis has certainly allowed us to be more accurate in terms of the identification of species (and species "lumped" or "split" accordingly), the same analysis hasn't been performed for subspecies (except for those that got "lumped" into a species which presumably have become subspecies). In other words, I believe that the vast majority of subspecies have been identified purely on their physical appearance (and not DNA analysis).

Wurzel wrote:what about the Wall Brown it's on an island and it could show exceedingly subtle variation from individuals on this side of the Irish Sea so how come it isn't considered a sub-species along with the others?

Because it exhibits no consistent physical differences from those on the mainland.

David M wrote:Does there have to be some kind of visual difference to attain ssp status?

Yes - according to the current approach for the identification of subspecies.

David M wrote:I have to confess that I can't with the Small Copper. So, why is phlaeas considered a subspecies yet Wall Brown is not?

Because Small Copper does consistently express a difference (even if it's subtle) whereas Wall doesn't. To be honest, for some subspecies, you'll only notice the differences if you're looking at museum specimens!

David M wrote:Brown Hairstreak must be the best geographical candidate for subspecies status in Ireland, as it is only found in the far west and it isn't a butterfly that flies long distances, meaning that there can be no dilution of the genes from the British mainland. However, betulae isn't terribly prone to visual aberrations whereas Graylings, for example, are.

Yep - Brown Hairstreak in Ireland look identical to those on the mainland, whereas Grayling don't. Simple as that! Now - if you were to look at the gene pool instead, you might have a very different story! But as things stand, subspecies are identified by physical appearance only.

David M wrote:Am I the only one that's confused?

Nope - Wurzel is confused too Just kidding. Good discussion.

Cheers,

- Pete

Pete Eeles wrote:Brown Hairstreak in Ireland look identical to those on the mainland, whereas Grayling don't. Simple as that! Now - if you were to look at the gene pool instead, you might have a very different story! But as things stand, subspecies are identified by physical appearance only.

Thanks for the explanation, Pete. I guess Brown Hairstreaks will have been geographically isolated from the mainland for longer, perhaps, than any other Irish species. One would suppose that at a genetic level this would be expressed, yet it doesn't naturally translate into physically observable differences.

One thing that's always intrigued me though...

...Cryptic Wood Whites. To my knowledge there's no record of them from the British mainland. So, is this a butterfly that was once sinapis that has diverged so much that it is considered a separate species, rather than subspecies?

I don't want to butt in on Pete's page, but it might just be helpful to note that some of the comments seem to equate the concept of a discrete population with the concept of a subspecies. The taxonomic level of subspecies is wider than that of population (although we have no standard, scientific nomenclature for it, a truly discrete breeding population is a valid taxonomic level). For a population or group of populations to be usefully classed as a subspecies there needs to have been divergence, and as Pete has said, the current approach (following the historical approach) still tends to require morphological divergence. I've often quoted Kudrna's assertion that the only truly natural taxonomic levels (for higher organisms) are the individual and the breeding community, or population. All other levels are to a greater or lesser extent arbitrary and introduced essentially so that humans can work some kind of manageable structure into the fluid and constantly changing kaleidoscope of nature.

Guy

Cheers Pete for clearing that up in a nutshell then the sub-species are formed through Allopatric speciation mainly and is these cases obviously and not para or sympatric speciation. Sorted I was just worried that butterflying would go the same way as birding with all the "splitting and clumping"

Have a goodun

Wurzel