www.ukbutterflies.co.uk

eccles wrote:The perceived advantage of APS-C over full frame isn't an advantage at all provided the pixel density is similar.

Correct. However, the temptation is always to compose using the full width of the viewfinder and thus move in closer, loosing the greater working distance advantage of AP-C, which effectively provides a cropped view. Thus, you'll tend to need a longer, heavier lens to preserve working distance unless you have amazing self discipline behind the camera - and with so many other things to think about, I'd rather compose using the whole view available and have a lighter set up.

When discussing of the difference between full frame and AP-C I was coming from the assumption of equal resolution. For me, the big advantage of full frame is the potential for lower pixel density, which offers benefits in lower noise and better tonality etc. Owning both the D300 and D700 has really bought this home to me. An interesting question to discuss is how much resolution you REALLY need? For landscape I shoot 5x4 sheet film which, when scanned produces staggering images of around 50 megapixel resolution. But they are huge files that make my Mac creak and and need big, expensive storage. I find my butterfly/habitat photography is rarely reproduced larger than A4 so 12 megapixels or so is more than enough in my 'real world'. And on the few occasions I need to go bigger, the files can take a increase in size very well. Certainly, while I own an A3 inkjet printer, the cost of printing this size makes means that I rarely use its full potential, and even my exhibition prints tend to be no larger than 18x12 inches.

Apologies to Steve if I'm going off topic.

Best

Malcolm

I think we went off topic days ago...I for get how this started now!

Hi Folks!

Thanks for all the advice and debate - even the stuff about APS-C and VR which I should probably know about

Think it's going to be a canon 100mm, lens hood (thanks Markulous) and a kenko pro300 TC - 1.4x or 2x - that's the next quandry

Steve

Think it's going to be a canon 100mm

Not a good move - in my humble opinion.
When I moved to DSLR (20D) from 35mm, I got one (a 100mm Canon Macro), thinking that it would be like a 160mm (I already had the Sigma 180mm, and was ready to sell it).
I sold the 100mm instead, and stuck with the Sigma 180mm (the 150mm didn't exist then)
I didn't like-
1/ The front elment moving in and out on focussing - and neither did butterflies.
2/ The close working distance.
3/ It feels "plasticy" and not as robust as a Canon L lens, or a Sigma EX.
4/ Tripod foot an expensive extra
5/ Lens Hood an expensive extra.

Go for the Sigma 150 - but you have probably heard that before.........

Roger

They may have updated the design - the front element does not move now IIRC. It is the only 100 mm macro where it does not. I don't think the build is shabby either, but the other points are still valid.

Yes correct the canon 100 certainly is the only one of canon, sigma and Tamron without an extending front. Also the only with USM and where the tripod collar is even an option (and from my experiences with the larger lenses that have this, a very worth addition if you are considering monopod shooting). Also I would think it is the much better built of the three.

FISHiEE wrote:Yes correct the canon 100 certainly is the only one of canon, sigma and Tamron without an extending front. Also the only with USM and where the tripod collar is even an option (and from my experiences with the larger lenses that have this, a very worth addition if you are considering monopod shooting). Also I would think it is the much better built of the three.

Yup, I'd have to agree - tho' I actually prefer the Sigma 105mm over the Canon (but I've not used it that much - just enough to establish the quality was no better!), one thing being because the Sigma doesn't have an USM focus (so shorter barrel roate when MF - very much easier/quicker). And having the Sigma 150mm to compare to the 105mm, so extending versus non-extending and closer versus a little further away, I'd have to say that neither have made any difference to me (but I do like the tripod collar on the 150mm!)

Hey guys and gals,

had a complete turn around and just bought a tamron 90mm *crossing fingers*. The reviews I read had it out performing sigma and canon for sharpness although build quality ain't great. Got it new for £194 so will get a tc to stick on it.

I believe ColinC (are you out there?) used a 2x teleconverter with this lens - any joy?

Again, thanks for the discussion and debate, despite my lens choice, I found it all v helpfull!

All the best for xmas and new year!

Steve

Agreed. It's meant to be the sharpest of the lot and I've been tempted to buy one myself and give it a go for that reason. Can't help on the tc front. Any tc will give some level of drop in image quality. I'd give it a go without one for starters and see how you get on. You can always add one later if you feel you need it.

Also before getting a TC, check how far the rear element is from the camera mount. If it's like the Sigma 105, i.e. reaching a millimeter or so beyond the mount into the camera mirror housing, then you may be restricted to generic types. Of the generics, the Kenko Pro300 is probably the best.

Welcome to the Tamron 90mm Club, Steve!
I have no experience of the other Macros mentioned - I also did a lot of research and have no regrets about the IQ. I have access to a Sigma 17-70mm F2.8-4.5 DC Macro and it certainly outperforms that - as it should.
I've looked at conventers since it would be nice to be able to get right-in and at 1:1 the temptation is to get too close and loose d.o.f. Need to stand-off a bit and crop.
Kenco was also recommended to me as a good complement to the Tamron.
Happy shooting!
N
PS Build quality is OK!

I've used the Tamron SP90 lens with the Kenko TC. The resolution is still pretty good and exceeds the sensors requirement, but the contrast drops a bit. (I've also tested it with a very nice digital test chart I managed to talk out of a salesman!).

Although they look a little flimsy compared with a Nikon lens for example, I've found my Tamron quite tough in practice.

Chris

Further on the tripod/monopod debate, if you use a monopod, get a shoulder brace. Pulling the camera/pod/brace to your shoulder will substantially reduce camera shake. Fortunately for me, the head tilt lever on my cheapo Jessops monopod is just the right length to act as a brace.

eccles wrote:Further on the tripod/monopod debate, if you use a monopod, get a shoulder brace.

..I just got one for Christmas (how did my daughter know?) - still to test it out in the field but seems to help stabilisation...
N

eccles wrote:Further on the tripod/monopod debate, if you use a monopod, get a shoulder brace. Pulling the camera/pod/brace to your shoulder will substantially reduce camera shake. Fortunately for me, the head tilt lever on my cheapo Jessops monopod is just the right length to act as a brace.

I have never even heard of a shoulder brace before! I think that I can understand how it might help to create much more stability.

Does the shoulder brace make it any more cumbersome to carry around?

I can see myself taking a trip to Park Cameras this weekend

Polly

Polly wrote:
Does the shoulder brace make it any more cumbersome to carry around?
Polly

Hi
Not really; it sits on top of the monopod - swivels 360 degrees and does flop around a bit - but since it weighs virtually nothing not too much of a problem. Can be fiddly getting the brace set-up for your shoulder......try it out if they have a brace in-stock
N

NickB wrote:

Polly wrote:
Does the shoulder brace make it any more cumbersome to carry around?
Polly

Can be fiddly getting the brace set-up for your shoulder......try it out if they have a brace in-stock
N

Thanks Nick

Yes, they did have one in stock and I did try it out and I did buy it

I was hoping for a bright, warm Sunday so I could go outside and take a few macro shots but I think I may stay indoors (it's perishing out there).

Polly wrote:I was hoping for a bright, warm Sunday so I could go outside and take a few macro shots but I think I may stay indoors (it's perishing out there).

LOL! It's been snowing here already - brief flurry only tho' (so far!)

Howdy all,

just to go full circle on the hand held issue, I recently bought myself a manfrotto tripod and the 322RC2 head. Still going to attempt to shoot hand held tho!! Getting very impatient for next season and am trying to convince the family that a holiday on the continent is in order, especially after seeing Roger's butterfliesoffrance website.

hope you all had a merry xmas and that 09 will be a happy and healthy one!


Steve

Excellent stuff. Same setup as I have

Europe - yes definitely worth it. The numbers and variety is amazing. I have 5 weeks on the trot in Europe this summer