www.ukbutterflies.co.uk

That is really interesting Neil - I have found myself instinctively cropping most of my images as you describe without the thought process- which absolutely makes sense - one from last weekend
Kind Regards
Mark

Gruditch wrote:No you can't do that to that picture, I'm calling the police.

Regards Gruditch

yes, it does seem like a crime has been committed there.

Mark Tutton wrote:That is really interesting Neil - I have found myself instinctively cropping most of my images as you describe ...

There is, actually, some "science" behind the art ... such as the rule of thirds. Some simply have a gift in this respect - and the rest of us need to analyse things (I'm in the latter category). "The Photographer's Eye" by Michael Freeman is, in my opinion, a "must read" for all photographers - it covers composition, colour contrast etc. in a rudimentary manner that is pretty powerful for a layman, such as myself.
Cheers,

- Pete

Pete Eeles wrote:

Testudo Man wrote:

Gruditch wrote:Of course if you do take a great picture like that, and crop like Mikes example. You should be arrested, and sent to prison, for crimes against photography.

Regards Gruditch

Cheers for the compliment on my original image but as i said above, Mikes version/crop, was always going to look "pants" because of the small file size that he had to use. I hope ive rectified this with my latest crop.

Cheers Paul.

Hi Paul - this is nothing to do with the file size and everything to do with the composition. If you want a photo that helps with the identification of specific features of the adult butterfly, then perhaps a closeup and constrained view where the butterfly has no room to breathe is it - but it's never going to win any prizes in a photo comp! However, if you want a work of art that you'd be happy mounting on a wall, then your 600 x 750 is pretty close, in my opinion.

Cheers,

- Pete

Thanks for that Pete ...since Im artistic by nature, i should forget about macro/close up images, and think more about the overall scene. But when im out in the field with my chosen subjects(not just butterflies) i cant help but try to get in close...I have to tell myself to back off, because its not always about macro photography.

Neil Hulme wrote:I don't usually comment on threads which discuss the technical aspects of photography, mainly because I don't have any knowledge of the subject. But this is more to do with the aesthetic; itself highly subjective, so we'll all see it differently.

The natural crop for me is as below. In the examples above I think the insect is too central. To my eye, the image requires significantly more space in front of the butterfly - that's where it will move to, when it takes off. Equal (or nearly so) distance behind it doesn't work for me. That's where it came from, before it landed, so is now history and redundant. To place it more centrally seems to gives the impression of it being stranded.

BWs, Neil

Crop.jpg

Cheers for the input Neil, and thanks for your crop and explanation.
My problem is, i seem to be programmed to look for symmetry/equal distances, and as a result, i crop with that in mind. Perhaps i should just look at the image, and crop by the image, not by the numbers.
By the way, i couldnt help but notice the size of your crop...ok, i looked ...it measured 681 x 511.
Maybe 680 x 510 ??...Darn those odd numbers

Cheers Paul.

It depends what you're after. But, in general, absolutely

Cheers,

- Pete

Errrrrrrrrrrrrrrr...ok, ive "cheated" here for the last crop/image

Ive given the butterfly more space to fly/move into, but still retained some sort of distance from the wing tip, to the left of the image.
All i used is an ancient Photoshop 6(which is 15 years old!!!) to edit this image, actually, Photoshop 6 is all i ever use for all of my images...but i dont normally edit them to this degree, i normally just adjust levels, sharpening, noise etc...just basic stuff.

So what did i do? just used my original photo, then another part of the original photo(right hand side, green background) then cloned out the joining line between the 2 layers.

But is this really "cheating"? What is cheating?...The photo is mine.

As before, all opinions are welcome.

Cheers Paul.

I have also occasionally added a little at the side of a photo, in an attempt to improve the overall balance. I feel that your 'anti-crop' needs a little more at the top.

On another controversial point - although the plain background is widely admired and considered to add to the artistic value, I often like to see a little more of the surrounding habitat, especially for photos taken 'in the wild' I once suggested (tongue in cheek) that one should carry around a selection of backgrounds to place behind a subject, to achieve the 'plain' effect

I posted a shot, last year, from the opposite end of the spectrum at download/file.php?id=59002&mode=view

Mike

MikeOxon wrote:I have also occasionally added a little at the side of a photo, in an attempt to improve the overall balance. I feel that your 'anti-crop' needs a little more at the top.

On another controversial point - although the plain background is widely admired and considered to add to the artistic value, I often like to see a little more of the surrounding habitat, especially for photos taken 'in the wild' I once suggested (tongue in cheek) that one should carry around a selection of backgrounds to place behind a subject, to achieve the 'plain' effect

I posted a shot, last year, from the opposite end of the spectrum at download/file.php?id=59002&mode=view

Mike

Hi Mike, i like that word you used - "Anti Crop"

Funny you should mention backgrounds, last year i stumbled across a guy(on some macro forum, cant remember which one now?!) who showed how he had made a couple of backgrounds. He had used tiny coloured beads, glued to sheets of small paper/card, in order to create the perfect background, for his macro work.
I said to my wife, thats it, im gonna give that coloured beaded background a go for 2015, it may just work...............She looked at me, like they do ...knowing full well that i wouldnt even get that idea "Past Go". I had the intention there though, just didnt get around to making any TBF, those beaded backgrounds might work with the average docile "Bug", but try placing a fake background behind an active butterfly!! Im pretty sure the butterfly would be gone in an instant, well before you even lined up your camera, let alone got the focus locked on.

I like your Small Tortoiseshell image too, it works well.
I have a few Flickr friends who ask me if i have any wider/environmental images of my Adders(Vipera Berus) in situ....Nope, you guessed it, 99% of my reptile images are up close/macro

Cheers Paul.