gardarwiniana

Discussion forum for any overseas items (given that this is a "UK" butterflies forum!).
Post Reply
User avatar
Reverdin
Posts: 488
Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 5:22 pm
Location: Northern England

gardarwiniana

Post by Reverdin »

As explained to me by GP during several discussions over the years, lately included.. thought I would collage 3 pics all taken in the Alps this year showing trends between Alpine and Darwin's Heath. Poor quality given the 800 pixel limit but open for comments if any!
Alpine ----------------- intermediate ----------------- Darwin's
Alpine ----------------- intermediate ----------------- Darwin's
User avatar
Padfield
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 8184
Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2006 10:19 pm
Location: Leysin, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: gardarwiniana

Post by Padfield »

Nice!

You could perhaps add a picture of arcania as a fourth on the right ...

Image

It continues the sequence.

As you know, my theory is that gardetta was the mountain form of arcania during the last Interglacial. They were separated and went their own ways during the subsequent Ice Age, then met again in the present Interglacial, when hybridisation between what were now different species produced darwiniana. There are regions in France where all three taxa are known to hybridise ...

I have absolutely no evidence to back up the theory, but there is clearly a close relationship between these three taxa, with darwiniana in the middle. Leander fits into the picture somehow, too!

Guy
Guy's Butterflies: https://www.guypadfield.com
The Butterflies of Villars-Gryon : https://www.guypadfield.com/villarsgryonbook.html
User avatar
Pete Eeles
Administrator & Stock Contributor
Administrator & Stock Contributor
Posts: 6779
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 6:10 pm
Location: Thatcham, Berkshire
Contact:

Re: gardarwiniana

Post by Pete Eeles »

Nice visualisation Paul and very reminiscent of Large Heath (scotica -> polydama -> davus). I guess the jury's out on the taxonomic status in this case! :?

Cheers,

- Pete
Life Cycles of British & Irish Butterflies: http://www.butterflylifecycles.com
British & Irish Butterflies Rarities: http://www.butterflyrarities.com
User avatar
Padfield
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 8184
Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2006 10:19 pm
Location: Leysin, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: gardarwiniana

Post by Padfield »

Most authors seem to regard gardetta and darwiniana as conspecific these days. This is what the Swiss Bible has to say about their distribution (it treats them as separate species, but was written in 1987):

'The species [darwiniana] has pure populations in the southern valleys of the Alps, notably in the Tessin, in the Val Mesolcina and on the southern slope of the Simplon. Visibly mixed populations are found practically everywhere in the southern valleys where C. gardetta and C. darwiniana meet, as well as in the Haut Valais, in the valleys of the Alpes uranaises and to the north of the passes of San Bernadino, La Bernina and Il Fuorn. These transitional forms, designated f. philedarwiniana and visibly hybrids, are often confused with C. darwiniana and sometimes with C. arcania. Their distribution needs to be studied in greater depth'.

Darwin himself would love all this evidence of evolution in action!

Guy
Guy's Butterflies: https://www.guypadfield.com
The Butterflies of Villars-Gryon : https://www.guypadfield.com/villarsgryonbook.html
User avatar
Pete Eeles
Administrator & Stock Contributor
Administrator & Stock Contributor
Posts: 6779
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 6:10 pm
Location: Thatcham, Berkshire
Contact:

Re: gardarwiniana

Post by Pete Eeles »

padfield wrote:Darwin himself would love all this evidence of evolution in action!
Indeed - and so do I :D

Cheers,

- Pete
Life Cycles of British & Irish Butterflies: http://www.butterflylifecycles.com
British & Irish Butterflies Rarities: http://www.butterflyrarities.com
User avatar
nik_s
Posts: 27
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2012 4:33 am
Contact:

Re: gardarwiniana

Post by nik_s »

Hi,

A little late with the reply, but thought you might find this interesting:

Martin Wiemers (1998). Coenonympha darwiniana - a hybrid taxon? New insights through allozyme electrophoresis
http://www.univie.ac.at/population-ecol ... s_1998.pdf

All the evidence you need to back your theory, Guy... :D

Cheers,
Nikolay Shtinkov (http://nsbutterflies.com)
User avatar
Padfield
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 8184
Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2006 10:19 pm
Location: Leysin, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: gardarwiniana

Post by Padfield »

Fascinating! Thank you, Nik.

The scenario on p.58 is exactly what I had speculated, albeit with considerably more flesh on the bones.

Guy
Guy's Butterflies: https://www.guypadfield.com
The Butterflies of Villars-Gryon : https://www.guypadfield.com/villarsgryonbook.html
Post Reply

Return to “Overseas”