Moving trees

[Dave McCormick]

I have a 7 year old sessile oak, bird cherry, a blackthorn, x2 grey sallow and 1 goat willow. I would like to move these to my new house garden in August but I got these a few months ago, all bare rooted. I was told if I moved them before they go dormant for the winter, the stress on moving them could be severe to them. Does anyone know if there anything I could do now so I would be able to move them in future? Could I transfer them into very large pots and keep them there until I moved? Big enough to keep their roots deep, such as putting each into a separate a large plastic storage box with holes in bottom to let out water?

[Gruditch]

Hi Dave, I would usually only move tree's and shrubs in the Autumn. But if that is not an option, then with a lot of hard work, you can move any tree, of any size, IF you don't disturb the root ball.

Get as bigger root ball as you can possibly lift, and wrap it in wet news paper for the move.

Regards Gruditch

[Dave McCormick]

Thanks, I will do that, hopefully with some TLC I can stop anything bad happening to them when and after moving.

[JohnR]

When it comes to the move make sure that the trees are well watered a few days before you lift them. I know it makes the root ball heavier but it reduces one of the stresses.

[Piers]

If you choose to container grow them Dave, keep them well watered (but not completely saturated as this will knacker them) and place the tubs in a bright, sheltered position, out of direct sun light.

When you plant them out following your move, prepare the ground well and remember that they shall need tlc for the whole of next year, even if you plant them out this autumn.

The salix species should be least at risk, followed by the blackthorn, the bird cherry, and least tollerant will be the oak.

However, as Gary says, it is far preferable to move them after they have entered dormancy. Perhaps there is some way you can come to an arrangement with the new occupiers to return to move the trees in the autumn..?

Piers.

[Susie]

As these have only been in the ground for a few months they won't have had the chance to have established a good root system where they are yet so I am sure that they will relocate without difficulty if you repot them now and treat them with the tlc outlined above. I've always found plants to be far hardier and more resilient than people give them credit for.

[NickB]

My own council could do with following all this sound advice....
Would we, as individuals spend £100+ on a tree, just to leave it to wither & die....

This year....
...they planted (I say planted - the holes were very shallow and narrow for the size of tree, and unprepared)
.....large container-grown 5yr old+ trees in March ....
....without any water-bags or plan it seems to water all these trees during the drought...
Suffice it to say, that their survival rate is very poor....
...so poor, they go through the whole exercise each year...
....plant-die-replace

....sounds OK, if you supply the trees...

....but NOT OK, if you are a council tax payer and paying for it all

[Dave McCormick]

Some never learn do they? Its not easy to get a tree to that age, and just to have it die? I usually dig a big, wide hole, water it really well, pop in the tree, cover it up and water again and water in times of drought (which happened to my oak tree, it didn't start producing leaves to well after normal time).

Its always good to leave enough space between each tree so they can grow and expand (one reason I hate plantations, even if they are of multiple trees, but if in a line close together they can't grow well) I have seen the results of right planting of a tree. There is a 170 year old oak here that was planted in open by owners of the land back then, and now its as max height and very big with a wide canopy. Also saw this with a beech tree with an 18ft girth.

Its what trees councils etc... decide to plant that I find important. No good planting a cypress or any other non native tree as it does no good, might look good to some, but not really, if you must plant something like that, get a Juniper, the native cypress. Too often I see these, eucalyptus, larch etc... planted instead of trees that do better for wildlife like oak and willows. I mean, eucalyptus looks really out of place in UK. At least sycamores in NI are being removed in many places.

In Belfast however, conservation volunteers have planted oak trees all over the place and there is many old oaks and there is even someone who helped plant some oaks and as he uses wood, only takes dead oak trees to use instead of cutting down a live one that took as long as they do to grow as big as they do.

[NickB]

I totally agree, Dave. Too many "pretty" or "specimen" non-native species get planted in our public places - often displacing native fruiting species, with non productive varieties which have flowers that our native insects can not use. It is scandalous, considering we all pay for this!
N

[Dave McCormick]

Just an update, started moving my trees in garden (images tomorrow, blowing a gale today so not goo photographing weather) and I put them in a row (with enough space of course) down near the fence. Have room for about a few more trees. Have x2 Oak (Sessile and English), x2 grey sallow, 1 goat willow, 1 elder, 1 blackthorn and a bird cherry (which I transported a red-green carpet larvae on it). Seem to be doing fine so far, except for the elder which appears to be dying, might be able to salvage it before its too late.

Have room for 3 more trees, so not sure which, can either get: Crab Apple, Guelder Rose, Rowan or Spindle. Can you grow crab apple in a large pot? Saw River Cottage and Hugh had is "orchard" of trees in pots since he didn't have the land to plant then in and made me think I could but not sure. Prone to getting quite windy here and foggy as only a mile from Strangford Lough and around 7-8 miles from the Irish Sea.

[JohnR]

Have room for 3 more trees, so not sure which, can either get: Crab Apple, Guelder Rose, Rowan or Spindle.

Why grow them as trees? and why not grow them and elder as a hedge? I have a 4 year old field hedge which includes just about anything I could get my hands on though I have allowed the Rowan amongst others, to grow up as trees. Spindle, guilder, blackthorn, hawthorn, salix, alder, beech, hornbeam, whitebeam, privet, sorbus (various), field maple, elder, hazel, etc. I have allowed to grow to a hedge height of about 4.5 feet simply because I want to look out over the field beyond. Hedge Browns love it, small rodents are using it. There was enough fruit on it last year to last into the new year. I cut it this year when the privet was flowering, everything else had already started to fruit, so I could avoid the berries. I'll cut back the long strands this month and give it a proper shaping cut in the early spring. This way you get more for your money. You should be able to buy a bundle or two of 70-100 cm bare-root mixed hedging quite cheaply, plant in November in a double row at about 5 plants a metre. I would use a glyphosphate weedkiller now to kill the grass for the hedge-line so that there is no competition in the first year.

[Dave McCormick]

John, I didn't think about it that way, but now you mention it, I have talked to Paul Waring before and he mentioned having one of every native tree around the edge of his garden and trims them so he can still chat with his neighbour, like a hedge. Think if I remember right, he said the moths that fed on the leaves like the young leave shoots rather than the older leaves (it was either that or he said that some moths use the older leaves and some use the younger leaves)

I assumed that growing them with a space between would get a better growing tree, more room for the roots, branches etc... I have a 10 year old cherry tree to put in soon. Might replace the elder with a new one as its quite small, yellowish and looks dying. I am in the process of growing loads of native trees from seeds, already have 11 Oak, 30 silver birch, 1 ash and x2 willows and an English elm.

I know a place that provides a lot of native trees so could do that. Suppose a few more willows would be good since they support over 270 species (as far as I know) with oak supporting the most but taking the longest to grow. There is a mature dog rose and honeysuckle at the bottom of the garden already. I can get tree in either 2-3ft or 3-4ft (except scots pine in 3-4ft but there is already quite a number of scots pine around here anyway)

[JohnR]

Here's one I prepared earlier. The photo is dated 2 June so it makes the hedge 4 1/2 years old. The copper beech was the only existing tree on the fence line. The tree in front of it is a Wild Service Tree and that's about 10ft, some of the sorbus must be 16ft. Yes some of the trees tend to suppress the hedging for a couple of feet round them but then I keep finding small holly or thorn seedlings to put in - if they survive, so well and good.

[Dave McCormick]

Looks great John. Here is what I have at moment (trees here are about 3-4ft tall roughly with two willows and blackthorn being tallest):

First two images of the fence where I want to have the trees (not good at distances so can't say how long the fence is but its a little longer than what image shows, as camera lens wasn't short enough to get the long shot I wanted):

Fence 1

Fence 2

Trees in at the moment from left to right: Blackthorn, Grey Sallow, Grey Sallow, Goat Willow, Bird Cherry and Elder (the very small one on the far right mear the building):

Trees

I could do something like you did and would be far better overall and looks good too.

[JohnR]

I meant to post this the day I took it but am confined to bed with some lurgy or other.
This shows my hedge from the sheep field side (they do the cutting for me) and also should show rabbit proofing, i.e. 4ft chicken wire with 1ft buried under the turf on the side they dig in from.

[Dave McCormick]

Thanks John, get better then, I can see it properly now, looks good. When I started planting my trees, neighbour on other side came and saw them and because of what I did, he is thinking of getting me to plant a lot of trees in a field he owns nearby, so more good for wildlife. Decided I may get a lot of 2-4ft trees (think the smaller ones would be good for willows that grow fast and larger trees for things like oak, ash) and I can grow them in similar fashion you did, smaller I can get them to grow in the right way. Don't really have much rabbits around here (not that I can see). BTW, did you have the same species growing side by side or did you put different species beside each other? My current list of trees I want to have are (possibly 1-3 of each). I have one English Elm growing but not sure if I'll add it, might take a long time to grow big enough:

Grey Sallow
Oak - Have a English and Sessile oak at moment
Alder Buckthorn
Blackthorn
Hazel
Common Osier
White Willow
Goat Willow
Birch (either downy or silver)
Crab Apple
Spindle
Aspen
Rowan
Bird Cherry
Elder
Irish Whitebeam (Sorbus hibernica) or Sorbus rupicola - May not be able to get this, hard to find places that grow it.

Don't have room for Scot's Pine. Have to see what I have room for and if I can grow all of this along the fence.