Swiss ID's Part 2

[Paul Wetton]

Yep I managed to remember to begin a new thread this time so we'll call it 2.

I'll begin with another Pyrgus and hope for the best. This was in a woodland clearing close to Evolene in the Val d'Herens.

Here's the upper side.
1.

carlinae?

and the under side.
2.

carlinae?

I suspect it was carlinae but maybe I have a fixation with this species now.

The next two photos I tentatively suggest are Heath Fritillary but with all the abnormal froms around I'm not 100% sure.
3.

athalia?

4.

athalia?

The next photos are from higher up near Mattmark and I'll start with another infamous Pyrgus. I'm hopeful that this is a Dusky Grizzled Skipper.
5.

cacaliae?

Next another of my weak spots and I have many. Shepherd's and Mountain Fritillary. T me it all seems to be very subjective with these. Do the spots come together or are they more parallel and are those lines thin or thick. Have a look. The first I suspect are all male Mountain Fritillary Boloria napaea. I reckon I've cracked the females they are mostly a different colour.
6.

napaea?

These boys are definitely different sizes and slightly different in patterning but I think they may both be napaea.

Heres there ups.
7.

napaea?

I think the next may be Shepherd's Fritillary. These were higher up the mountain and appear to have thicker black lines in the discal region of the forewing and the spotting on said wings appears to come together more so at space 4 than with the previous picture. This however, seems very sunjective to the angle the wings are viewed from. Here's the photos.

Male Shepherds ups?

pales?

Male Shepherd's uns?
8.

pales?

and finally female Shepherds uns?
9.

pales female?

The next are from a site lower down alongside a river. The first two are hopefully a doddle.

Dusky Meadow Brown.
10.

lycaon?

The next caught me by surprise when checking Helens photos. It is an Apollo but has red on the forewing beyond the cell and appears to have striped antennae bringing me to the conclusion it may be a Small Apollo. However, as always the antennae don't appear as clear cut black and white as in the books and that red spot I always expected to be closer to the costa. Here it is.

11.

phoebus?

The final species at this site is another Skipper. I have three photos here and am not convinced they are all the same butterfly or even the same species. The first 2 match with my filming and I suspect these are possibly Mallow Skipper.

12.

alceae?

13.

alceae?

This third photo I originally thought the same insect but on inspection it appears to be more black and white on the hindwing ups. Unfortunately this is the only photo we have and I didn't see this one to film it. It could be the same butterfly with poor lighting through me trying to enhance it to see it.

14.

?????

Do Tufted Marbled Skippers occur in this area?

Thanks for looking. Ant help greatly appreciated.

[Padfield]

Hi Paul,

I think your Pyrgus looks most like male carlinae.

The next two are almost certainly heath fritillary - I don't see any real problem there.

No. 5 is definitely cacaliae - well done!

The larger Boloria (further away in the second picture) is definitely napaea. The nearer one could very well be an extremely linear pales palustris. Compare it with this, which I know to be pales:



The next Boloria is certainly pales - of the slightly more macular form that flies in certain parts of Valais (I won't say where, because as you know I don't like mentioning locations for anything in a public forum).

I agree with you about the female pales below.

Dusky meadow brown, yes, for sure.

Strangely, though, I think that's just a slightly aberrant Apollo, not a small Apollo. The red is in s5 not s8. Apollo can have a little red (I've never seen that much) in s5 but small Apollo always has red in s8.

All the Carcharodus are mallow.

Now see what Roger, Reverdin et al. have to say!

Guy

[Paul Wetton]

Thanks again for your invaluable input Guy.

I suspected that the Apollo may be just that, but I thought the antennae were banded black & White as well as the red spot showing so it made me think twice.

I see what you mean about the pales palustris. The discal markings appear slightly different to the Napaea a bit thicker and slightly wavey but very similar. Not sure about the indentation of the sub marginal spots. I think I'd have to leave this one to you more experienced chaps.

Thanks again

[Roger Gibbons]

I agree with the IDs on this set. Fairly straightforward, much more so than the last set. I wondered if the third Carcharodus was in fact flocciferus (greyish colour and white uph discal spots) but the uph discal spots are not really sufficiently developed. The alceae I see are usually clearly brown rather than grey.

The phoebus antenna are more strikingly ringed black and white, in my limited experience of this species. Also phoebus is almost always found very close to water.

[Padfield]

Flocciferus males, in CH at least, always have a kind of gossamer veil over the forewings and a nebulous white wedge reaching in from the outer margin near the apex. They never appear neat and bright, with narrow linear designs, like Paul's Carcharodus.

At my last house I was privileged to have flocciferus breeding in the garden so I came to know them very well!



Guy

[Paul Wetton]

Thanks again for your help Roger and Guy.

I'll try you with probably the last set of photos tomorrow and then I'll upload some video. Not sure if video will be any easier than photos. You may have answered many of my questions by discussing the photos anyhow.

Thanks again.