Forest sell-off

[Zonda]

Going back to the original question. Government plans, are government plans,,,, end of story. We vote them in, and they do what they like. We can riot (Egypt), protest (Scargill), and generally cause some disruption, mostly at our own detriment. If you don't like the policies, put your cross somewhere else. At the last election most people voted for 'change', and then found out that change was in fact 'cuts'. Not intelligent, gradual, sympathetic cuts, but ruthless,( we've been out of power for years, and want to get our own back on all you people responsible), thoughtless cuts. I give up on governments.

[Jack Harrison]

At least there is a pause to give time for reflection:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-12428814

Jack

[NickB]

Back on-topic - Interesting article on page 21 of the new BC Butterfly magazine that illustrates the land-scape scale projects we have been talking about, the involvement of the FC and their funding of the project. BTW - Nice Duke, Gary!

[Gruditch]

Cheers Nick.


Unfortunately, whether you wish the FC to retain control over our forests or not, will eventually make no difference.

In 2003 FC land comprised of 880.827 ha, by 2010 it was down to 258.000. Did you know there is legislation in place, that in every 4 year period the incumbent government can sell 15% of FC land, so by my reconing in around 40 years time, there will be less than 50.000 ha left.

Regards Gruditch

[NickB]

Unfortunately, whether you wish the FC to retain control over our forests or not, will eventually make no difference.
In 2003 FC land comprised of 880.827 ha, by 2010 it was down to 258.000. Did you know there is legislation in place, that in every 4 year period the incumbent government can sell 15% of FC land, so by my reconing in around 40 years time, there will be less than 50.000 ha left.
Regards Gruditch

Yep! That may be true - for now!
The impetus in the argument has changed in favour of the public; the real debate starts now.
I think now is the time to expose these truths, such as the above, so that we can make sure these measures are also examined in the light of the forest's obvious value to the nation. That value extends beyond just the conservation angle - an attack on the forests, and our rights to use them, is also a symbolic attack on part of our collective national heritage, which is why I believe it has provoked such an outcry.
So, there is a chance we can bring heritage and conservation closer together in the nation's mind, which can only be a good thing, since then our politicians will start to listen, once votes are at stake.

[Piers]

an attack on the forests, and our rights to use them, is also a symbolic attack on part of our collective national heritage

Strong and emotive language there Nick; but I must have missed something while following the debate: given that an attack is generally an offensive against an enemy, who is attacking our forests..??

[Jack Harrison]

Yes Gary, nice front cover of Butterfly. Was it taken in that clearing you showed me last May? I don't think you'd seen Dukes there before but had an inspired hunch you'd find it. I do of course know which wood it was but I very much doubt if I'd be able to find the exact spot again. Let us know how the Duke is doing there this year - presuming you visit again.

I'll probably get my Duke of Burgundy "fix" this year at a rather less obscure locality such as Totternhoe Quarry.

Jack

[NickB]

I'm just banging the drum, Felix....

[Piers]

With my Moderator hat on, let's keep this valuable thread on topic and be careful not to let this descend into a political rant; I can rant with the best of them, but have to restrain myself while on UKB. Otherwise it could deter others from posting their point of view.

If you want an anti-coalition forum Nick, you could do alot worse than these...

Felix.

[Jack Harrison]

There’s no escaping the fact that Forest sell-off is inextricable linked to politics.

Jack

[JohnR]

There is an aspect of the "sell off" that few seem to be considering. The recent influx of disease to some of our woodland and forest which the Forestry Commission is working hard to control. The most recent and most damaging being Phytophthora ramorum see http://www.forestry.gov.uk/pramorum We may not mourn the culling of stands of larch but the chance of replanting them with native woodland is zilch because the disease is also known as sudden oak death. Horse chestnuts are having a hard time from drought, the leaf miner moth, whose larvae eats the leaves, and a disease known as bleeding canker. All we need to top this off is an influx of the Gypsy Moth (Lymantria dispar), and don't forget that Dutch Elm disease is still rampant.

I know we don't all love the Forestry Commission and I know that I have had a couple of run-ins with them over grants and felling licences, but they have become environmentally aware over the years and better the devil we know than one or more that we don't, we still need a national policy for our woodlands. Imagine the Dept. of Environment reacting in the same way to tree diseases as they did to foot and mouth.

[Piers]

There’s no escaping the fact that Forest sell-off is inextricable linked to politics.

Absolutely Jack, however it is perfectly possible to discuss and debate the matter without climbing onto a soapbox and espousing one's own general political beliefs or using the forum as a forum(!) to vent one's spleen and bash the current holders of the keys to No.10, whoever they may be at any given time. (NOT that I am suggesting for one moment that this is what you were doing Nick).

Clearly one's political stance on a particular issue will probably come across as an issue or topic is discussed, and I would expect (certainly when discussing a potato as hot as this) for feelings to run high and for some pretty strong opinions to be expressed. However, I do feel that it is possible to keep the thread on-topic without it descending into general political grandstanding and expressions of dissatisfaction that one's political colour of choice is not running the country.

UKB is a very lenient forum. The majority of fora which are not directly religious or political do not tolerate politics or religion at all.

Besides, I don't need to explain this because you know exactly what I mean I am sure.

Felix.

[Jack Harrison]

I have come across an interesting situation – call it a possible loophole if you like – in the Forest sell-off plans.

We have a village party tonight – technically known as the Annual Sloe Gin competition – where I will be chatting to various people who might be able to help, for example two or three farmer/landowners. I’ll see if I can buttonhole the tame lawyer but he doesn’t always attend these events.

I won’t to go into details just yet. It’s early days and I don’t want to risk it all going wrong.

Jack

[Matsukaze]

Hi John,

The Gypsy Moth is already here, in parts of London and in Aylesbury I think, an inadvertent import.

[Zonda]

Felix

Absolutely Jack, however it is perfectly possible to discuss and debate the matter without climbing onto a soapbox and espousing one's own general political beliefs

OOPS!

[Zonda]

No sweat Felix, i can see your point, and where you're coming from. Gotta keep the site on track.

[NickB]

Re: Soap Box.....

[Gruditch]

Yes Gary, nice front cover of Butterfly. Was it taken in that clearing you showed me last May? I don't think you'd seen Dukes there before but had an inspired hunch you'd find it. I do of course know which wood it was but I very much doubt if I'd be able to find the exact spot again. Let us know how the Duke is doing there this year - presuming you visit again.

I'll probably get my Duke of Burgundy "fix" this year at a rather less obscure locality such as Totternhoe Quarry.

Jack

Cheers Jack

No this one I took a year or two ago, it was in the same complex but about a mile North.

Regards Gruditch

[Jack Harrison]

Yesterday I wrote (ref a possible loophole I'm investigating):

We have a village party tonight – technically known as the Annual Sloe Gin competition – where I will be chatting to various people

The farming/landowner types weren't very interested. The "tame" lawyer wasn't there. So no real progress at the moment.

And unsurprisingly, I didn't win the Competition for the simple reason I hadn't entered.

Jack

[Charles Nicol]

Hi John,

The Gypsy Moth is already here, in parts of London and in Aylesbury I think, an inadvertent import.

Surely this should be referred to as The Travelling Community Moth ...

Charles