Skipper (SW Turkey)

[Ray Baker]

Hi,

Not sure if anyone would be able to help me with an id for this Skipper - sorry, it's not a UK butterfly at all, but was actually seen last week near Dalyan in SW Turkey.

It wouldn't really co-operate very well as grds views or photos, so not much to go on, I'm afraid...

I am familiar with Small & Essex Skippers from the UK, and got the impression that this was a bit bigger - I was thinking of maybe Levantine Skipper - T. hyrax?

Any help much appreciated.... Ray

[Martin]

If it was me, with the slightly larger overall size, the slightly longer wing, dark antennae, and the goldy coloured margins, I'd be putting a tick in my Levantine box...but I've got two right and two wrong this week so what do I know? The only problem you have is that it's supposed to be very local to the Aegean
islands of Lesbos, Samos, Chios and Rhodes.
Martin.

[Padfield]

It's worth remembering that the European field guides don't cover species found east of the Aegean islands and that there are quite probably several more Thymelicus species to be found in Turkey. Of the European species, I certainly favour hyrax for this, because it is a male and has an almost invisible sex brand - the species I am familiar with have far more prominent sex brands. Hyrax is found (apparently) on islands just off the SW coast of Turkey. If it's important, though, I would get a field guide to the butterflies of Turkey.

Guy

EDIT - according to this website, hyrax flies across Asia Minor:

http://www.funet.fi/pub/sci/bio/life/in ... index.html

[Padfield]

Actually, I'm not so sure it's a male now. I do still think hyrax is the most likely species, from the appearance.

Guy

[Martin]

Guy,
Have you got Lafranchis? (I suspect you will have ) Bottom right photo on page 28 is almost a carbon copy of the shot above.

M.

[Ray Baker]

Guy,
Have you got Lafranchis? (I suspect you will have ) Bottom right photo on page 28 is almost a carbon copy of the shot above.

M.

Hi Martin,

Excuse my ignorance..... Lafranchis? .... is that a Field Guide?

As you will have gathered, I don't have a copy, so what is the species on P28?


Thanks... Ray

[Pete Eeles]

Excuse my ignorance..... Lafranchis? .... is that a Field Guide?

Hi Ray - take a look here:

http://www.ukbutterflies.co.uk/books.php

and look for "Butterflies of Europe".

Cheers,

- Pete

[Martin]

Guy,
Have you got Lafranchis? (I suspect you will have ) Bottom right photo on page 28 is almost a carbon copy of the shot above.

M.

Hi Martin,

Excuse my ignorance..... Lafranchis? .... is that a Field Guide?

It is.

As you will have gathered, I don't have a copy, so what is the species on P28?

Lavantine

Martin.

[Ray Baker]

Guy,
Have you got Lafranchis? (I suspect you will have ) Bottom right photo on page 28 is almost a carbon copy of the shot above.

M.

Hi Martin,

Excuse my ignorance..... Lafranchis? .... is that a Field Guide?

It is.

As you will have gathered, I don't have a copy, so what is the species on P28?

Lavantine

Martin.

Thanks Martin,

I think that's good enough for me!! I'm quite picky about my bird-list but I don't really keep a butterfly list as such, so I'm more than happy to put this one down as Levantine - it was certainly bigger that either Small or Essex, and there don't seem to be too many other possibilities....

I had a look at the blurb that Pete pointed me at re: the Field Guide.... problem being that I've only just shelled out £20 for the Collins FG for Europe.

Have to say that whilst the plates in the Collins are really good, the text is a bit hard going for a non-expert, and the Lafranchis sounds like it might be a bit easier to use. Any thoughts as to how the two compare?


All the best... Ray

[Martin]

I have both...

Lafranchis goes with me in the field, Toleman and Lwingon sits on the shelf above my computer. I use Lafranchis much more, but if I could only have one it would have to be the Collins because of the informaton, Lafranchis really is only for IDing... I recommend having both (I also have the David Newland book, the Adrian Riley book and the Collins Gem...I could live without them but wouldn't want to )

Martin.

[Padfield]

The problem with Tolman is that he doesn't actually describe the butterflies, generally leaving it to the reader to work out the distinctive characters from the plates. This is OK for an experienced observer, who only needs to be guided to critical details separating closely related species, but not so good for a beginner who only knows that his butterfly is Erebia, for example, and doesn't really know where to begin within the genus. Lafranchis is good for this (and it is an excellent book) but I think the best is a first edition Higgins and Riley (or a later edition of the same, in hardback format). H & R give a proper description of every species and include a 'similar species' section at the end of each species. I love Brian Hargreaves's pictures too, perhaps because I grew up with them.

Unfortunately H & R doesn't extend as far as hyrax.

Guy

[Ray Baker]

Thanks for your help guys... sounds like I need to be having a word with my children...I'm thinking Father's Day is just around the corner!!


All the best.... Ray