Italy

[Martin]

I'm off to Milan working this weekend ...I was wondering if anyone knew what I might expect to see? I'll be at the Autodromo Nazional Monza (National Motor Racing Circuit)

Martin.

[Pete Eeles]

Racing cars?

Cheers,

- Pete

[Martin]

I'll be shooting them for pay...I want some new b/flys for the soul

Martin.

[Martin]

Well, it was torrential rain most of the time so only saw one butterfly (no Photo) I'm in the process of trying to ID it.

M.

[Chris Pickford]

If you get the chance next time, try the valleys north of Milan close to the Swiss border - they are absolutely glorious for b'flies (I spent a happy 8 years working there....).

Chris

[Martin]

Oops I did get a photo.

It's almost a Small Heath but not quite...a little largr too I think.



Martin.

[Padfield]

This does look strange but I feel it is nevertheless a small heath - perhaps a slightly melanic individual. The markings are closer to small heath than any of the other heaths - particularly in that there are no postdiscal or submarginal markings on the hindwing. It's true that small heaths usually have vestigial spots in the pd region, but the other species typically have much more developed spots.

I suspect that's not what you wanted to hear, so this advice comes with the usual caveat, that I might be wrong...

Guy

[Will]

I saw one similar, but not quite the same as this in Extramedura, Spain in April 2007. I came to a similar conclusion. It was the same size as Small Heath and was most similar to that species. Or is there a new species out there waiting to be discovered?

[Dave McCormick]

by the looks of it, I would say it is a small heath. see here: http://www.leps.it/SpeciesPages/CoenoPamphi.htm

[Roger Gibbons]

Here's one I saw a couple of weeks ago in the Alpes Maritimes at an altitude of 1000m.

coenonympha pamphilus_10391.JPG (143.79 KiB) Viewed 913 times

[Martin]

I've been looking a lot at SH photos since I shot the one above (and bearing in mind I saw another that was exactly the same) and have yet to see one where the markings on the unh wasn't clearly defined...on my one it seems to be non existant. The two I saw were in the middle of a big park in the center of a city (Milan) so I was wondering, cut off from other gene pools, if they had developed into a sub species (a la Darwin) Thoughts anyone?

Martin.

[Padfield]

I think you'd need more than one photo to claim Coenonympha pamphilus V6GTOeae but it's quite possible that there is a distinct local population. Perhaps melanism is favoured in a city context, as it is with peppered moths...

The heaths in general, being fairly sedentary, do split readily into nameable forms, clines and subspecies. In the Rhône Valley, for example, it is clear (I think) that the historic ancestor of many of the heaths is arcania (which flies widely in the lowland regions), seeding the mountain species darwiniana and gardetta up the tributary valleys, and with the intermediate form philedarwiniana (apparently a hybrid) between the domains of pure gardetta and darwiniana.

Guy

[Martin]

Perhaps I need to get back straight away Well, as soon as I get back from Spain anyway (leaving thursday for a week )

M.

[Padfield]

I'm eager to see your pics, Martin!!

Guy

[Martin]

I'm eager to see your pics, Martin!!

Guy

I'm going to try to concentrate on Skippers...I'm sure there are at least 4 or 5 different species on my patch that look pretty similar.

Martin.